Roster

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Is there or does anyone have a definitive roster of the DAR?

If in fact there is not much perhaps it is something then to be considered as another project for us here.

Steve

[Ric]

Are you looking for locos rolling stock what. You can buy the ORERs that show your h rolling stock. Ithink Gary Nss was supposed to be putting a full loo oster ogether fo his final DAR book.

Ric

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Sorry to be so long to reply Ric. The whole server thing (and even work!) kept me pretty busy this month.

As Gary Ness said in his book, the geneology of DAR locos is extremely difficult to nail down because of all the amalgamation and lack of concrete records from W&AR through to the CPR.

It seems that it's more likely that though folklore and personal collections and photos and recollections and people, that the history of the DAR can be recovered piece by piece.

I already had a Wiki in mind but your last post convinced me that a Wiki was probably the best way that we as a collective can really make an effective roster.

I hope you like the idea.

[downeastrailfan]

There has been much coverage of locos, but other rolling stock has been ignored.

I would like to see info on cabooses, RDC's, passenger cars, and MOW equipment.

Two SW1200RS units have been missed in the roster. 1271 and 1272 were here for a short time in the late 80's.

RDC's were the origional 9058 and 9059 assigned in 1956. In 1966, 9058 was involved in a head on crash with a Burro crane. It was sent to Montreal for repairs. From photographic evidence, 9057 (a phase I car) replaced it. 9058 and 9059 were phase II cars.

See the following posting from David Othen:

"As a start to the research on dayliners that operated on the DAR I
began
photographing them in 1974 and I have the following slides (unless
otherwise
stated they are in hockey mask with CPRail and packman symbol:

9049 June 1976 near Bedford
9049 June 1976 at Windsor Junction station - 4 shots using signal
mast to
get different elevations while loading/unloading passengers (wouldn't
do
that today!)
9050 Nov 1979 near Rockingham Canadian Pacific lettering on maroon -
hockey
mask front
9050 as above April 1979 Fairview - hockey mask very faded and chipped
9050 July 1979 Halifax station livery as before (2 shots - roof still
on
station)
9050 Nov 1979 as above passing Fairview
9050 July 1979 Bedford Basin same livery
9050 April 1980 still in same livery Fairview overpass
9057 6:30 pm 15 June 1974 entering Rockingham 9057 June 1975
Rockingham. (2
shots - one with family getting off)
9057 June 1975 passing under Fairview overpass
9059 May 1977 4 shots at or leaving Kentville
9062 29 June 1974 near Beaverbank Road (front and rear)
9062 Kentville Shops August 1974
9062 June and October 1976 leaving Halifax station (2 shots)
9062 29 May 1976 entering Rockingham
9067 November or December 1974 Annapolis Royal (2 shots)
9072 7 July 1979 fuelling at Kentville and changing crews with
passengers on
board! Then two more shots entering Kentville
9072 19 August 1978 Rockingham
9072 late August 1978 Rockingham
9072 July 1979 from Fairview overpass

I believe I have a couple of other shots that have not been re-filed
after
the slide shows! I know that I have one of a CP dayliner on the rear
of the
Ocean or Scotian passing through Londonderry in the snow.

Conclusion:

9057 was in use in 1974 and 1975
9062 in 1974 and 1976
9067 in late 1974
9049 in 1976
9072 in 1978 and 1979
9050 in 1979 and 1980
9059 in 1979

Hence at least 7 different dayliners worked on the DAR in the 1970s

David Othen"

David missed photographing 9060 (phase II). It was on the DAR in the mid 70s.

The DAR was slow to change over to Via operations. I understand this had to do with the unions. This happened in 1980. After that, RDC maintenance may have ceased at Kentville, and transferred to CN's Fairview (Halifax) roundhouse. Can anyone clarify that?

RDC's from the Via pool now protected the DAR run. For the first time, RDC-2 cars operated on the DAR as well. Via 6221 was originally owned by the MKT, and was their only RDC, ran on the DAR.

That's about all I can think of for now.

Matt Keoughan

[downeastrailfan]

The b&w photo, titled DAR 9059 at Yarmouth is incorrect as far as I can tell. The Yarmouth station was brick and flat sided. Digby station has a pitched roof and overhang, more along the lines of a traditional station. Also at Yarmouth, the yard is at the bottom of a hill. In photos, buildings are visible at the top of this hill. A grey house in older years, the KFC later.

What do the rest of the users think?

Matt Keoughan

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Wow. Great post.
I wholeheartedly agree that a roster of other equipment is totally necessary. And if you check the wiki you will find that's what is happening there too. I have set up categories for passenger (including RDCs), freight and MOW equipment (including vans).

If you have any further information regarding those items you can edit the wiki directly or post them here and I'll transfer them over. Check out the MOW stuff to start: http://dardpi.ca/wiki/index.php?title=Category:Mow

I will update the diesel category to include 1271 and 1272. I suspected there were more and I am pleased that you have confirmed that.

I was more than pleased to hear you shed light on the appearance of DAR9057. You can see from this wiki photo in 1968 that we have a shot of 9057 at Windsor junction but why 9057 was assigned was a mystery until you wrote that last post. As for the rest of the RDC units you have listed, I shall create pages acknowledging their existance on the DAR. I shall also ask David if he would supply some photos of these units as he has already been so kind as to supply the majority of the photos for the diesel units that are recorded on the wiki roster.

Regarding 9059 at Yarmouth (http://dardpi.ca/wiki/index.php?title=I ... rmouth.jpg) I think you have a point that needs to be clarified. I never thought it was in front of the station anyway; I thought it was in front of the freight shed which was across the tracks and down to the left of the station but now that you questioned it, I compared it with the freight station photos on the wiki and it looks a lot like the Yarmouth freight station but that chimney and the roof dormer just visable above the radiators on the RDC do not in fact look like Yarmouth. So the mystery deepens. As this is a photo in Jeff's collection it seems he doesn't have any more info that what he supplied so.... any one.. where do you think this is?
Check what I have catalogued so far on freight sheds: http://dardpi.ca/wiki/index.php?title=C ... ight_Sheds

[downeastrailfan]

Steve:

Can you create a section for industrial locomotives? I have several shots of the Canadian Gypsum 45 and 25 tonners.

Matt Keoughan

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Yes I will. That was an important industry for the DAR.

Give me some time to think about how I'll organize it so that other private industries served by the DAR will fit in as well.

I'll let you knwo when I've got it done.

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OK Matt. I've got an initial idea for a hierarchy for categorization for Private Locomotives.

It's on the wiki here: http://dardpi.ca/wiki/index.php?title=C ... ocomotives

See what you think.

[downeastrailfan]

See the following list for privately owned locos: http://www.railways.incanada.net/indust ... Scotia.pdf

Look under Dimocks, Wentworth and Windsor.

4-6-0 no. 555 is listed as being sold to Canadian Gypsum. I have not read this anywhere else, so I am interested to learn more, especially to see a photo.

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Collin Churchers site is really good isn't it?

If industrial locos are your thing, feel free to have at it and create as many articles for as many locos and rolling stock as you see fit.

Most people are baffled by a wiki but it's actually very simple to get going. The basic units of a wiki are articles and categories.

There's no where on the menu to create either. You simply put in the search box the name of the page you wish to create like for example CG01 for Canadian Gypsum loco No. 1. Then click the go button. Because this page does not exist, it will offer to create it, which you accept of course. Now you have a blank window. Paste in a page from another locomotive article so all the headings are already done and then modify it to the locomotive you wish to create. The trick is at the bottom to link this to a category so you can find it after. In this case of GC01, the only category for now it need to be linked to is:
[[Category:Canadian Gypsum]].

Never worry about losing and thing or deleting anything. The wiki can retrieve anything "deleted" and we can find anything you may think is lost. Wikis are tough! Don't be afraid to experiment.

By the way, the way to create a new category is to type in the search box Category:NewCat or what it is you wish to create. Alternatively by putting a new category [[Category:NewCat]] at the bottom of the article, once the page is saved and the new category link is clicked on it will offer to create a new Category page which of course you would do. Sub category pages then at the bottom will have a category as well to point upwards [[Category:ParentCategory]].

Because this wiki is Mediawiki software, the manual on-line is the best source for anything else you may be wondering about.
http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/MediaWiki_User's_Guide

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Just a quick note that with the discovery of the C.P.R. M.P. 14 Motive Power Rosters at the CPHA (http://cpsig.ca) site, I have been able to add in quite a few previosly unknown (to the wiki at least) locomotive and passenger cars. Take a look!

I also have been cross referencing locomotives by C.P.R. type, builder, wheel arrangement and just tonight I also added a category called "Steam Gallery" so that all the photos with steam power can be browsed on one page. Enjoy.

[Evangelineroute]

Steve:

Enjoying the expanded Steam Gallery.

I think a correction my be in order in the details of DAR2511.

The location is Evangeline Wharf, Yarmouth but the vessel is not Princess Helene. Note the "E" in the pennant on the ship's funnel, denoting Eastern Steamships. During the post-war era, their vessel Evangeline performed most of the duties on the Boston-Yarmouth service.

Princess Helene was a Canadian Pacific Steamship built for, and dedicated to the Saint John-Digby run.

Therefore, we may conclude "the vessel in the back-ground is probably Eastern Steamship's Evangeline".


Fred

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Thanks for the note Fred. I thingk we're all having fun putting this together.

Question: What was the difference between the S.S. Yarmouth and the Evangeline? Same owners? Sister ships?

I have this shots from the wiki of the Yarmouth from 1949 that look exactly like the ship in 2511:
http://dardpi.ca/wiki/index.php?title=I ... f_1949.jpg

And these ones of the Evangeline:
- from 1954: http://dardpi.ca/wiki/index.php?title=I ... R2617c.jpg
- date unknown : http://www.gov.ns.ca/nsarm/virtual/maca ... &Language=

both have 2 masts, 1 smoke funnel, 3 lifeboats on the rear quarter and a multitude of funnels all more or less in the same place.

Not being a steamship guy, I really don't know which is which.

[Evangelineroute]

Steve,

Yes, Yarmouth and Evangeline were sister ships! This leads to all sorts of confusion, especially on my part. I mis-spoke in identifying the Vessel in DAR2511..it should be the Yarmouth.

It has taken me a while to re-discover the reference but this should help:

Harry Bruce in Lifeline, The Story of the Atlantic Ferries and Coastal Boats on page 183, states that, following wartime service, the Yarmouth and Evangeline were returned to Eastern Steamship in 1947. " In the summer, only the Yarmouth came home to the historic service between New England and Nova Scotia; and in the mid-fifties (probably 1954 was the last season), she quite coming back in even in warm months. After that, she and the Evangeline went to work for a company under a Panamanian flag as ferries between Florida and the Bahamas;....." He goes on to state the Evangeline returned to the Boston -Yarmouth run for only one season in 1958, under a Canadian subsidy.

Web sites providing a summary of the history of Eastern Steamships and its successors, state the Evangeline was laid-up from 1948-1953.

To be continued.

Fred